South Africa-Poland 1:0. Let The Excuses Begin…

“There are roughly 15 to 20 million people of Polish ancestry living outside Poland, making the Polish diaspora one of the largest in the world.” http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polonia
http://culture.polishsite.us/articles/art79fr.htm I am a Pole to whom it is not given to be a Pole. (to play on words of Czesław Miłosz). Do feel that way, but a fan nevertheless.

The lack of depth and lack of player enthusiasm and drive, sure does make it tough on the fans. I was thinking same as a’s forlorn rant, to which I could add ‘what’s the point’ of caring about a team that doesn’t seem to care about itself or winning. Keep thinking though things got to get better. Maybe we’ll see a turn for the better in the Greece friendly. … a fan nevertheless.

Posted from  United States

Zaraza – Perfect explanation, could go a little deeper and and say it all starts with America and Englands Treachory towards poland in ww2… but then i’d sound like my Dziadek so draw a line there i think

To be honest i dont know why everybody is so irate, if it was our first team that just got those results then yeah… panic, but it was’nt, it was a couple of players on the verge of our starting 11 and some players who were trying for the first time. what has happened is a good thing, now we know who is’nt good enough to perform on a national level and who is without having to try them out during an important match. And lets be honest… anyone here cares about the fifa rankings about as much as the pope cares about who wins the eurovision song contest. Junk!

Posted from  Greece

And consider the opposition. I know Iraq isn’t a threat to win the World Cup, but they are the reigning Asian champions. Its not like just because you’re from UEFA you could win the Asian Championship. So the Asian Champs brought their A game, Poland didn’t. And as for South Africa. Well, they were at home preparing for the warm up tournament to the World Cup. They’re all kinds of excited. Poland limped into these friendlies. And the way they came back against Iraq was actually a good sign. The action was fast and it was back and forth, and to me the defense and the goalkeeper looked confident. The thing we should be complaining about is that the usual starting eleven don’t play like this. Remember who we are. We’re not a team that’s going to win the World Cup yet. Our expectations may be overshooting what we’re capable of. Look at Turkey, I doubt the Turkish fans are giving their national team this much heat and they should be locks for South Africa after their Euro perfomrance.

By making the excuse that it was only our “B” team I think you are just accepting a level of failure, lowering the standard. These guys should be embarrassed to call themselves footballers. Countries that win never take any game lightly. Countries that win always take a professional approach to each game. You are acknowledging that what those guys displayed was acceptable. I am not taking anything away for the opposition but our guys looked terribly out of place. I’m not sure how many people watched u-21 Poland play against Liechtenstein. Those guys showed they can play. No problems with fundamentals. They had some kind of game plan, a strategy that they tried to execute. So why is the senior team such a disaster?

Let me tell you, if that is what the Ekstraklasa could produce that I am sorry but no thank you. I’m not going to support a bunch of clowns running around in circles looking stupid. If the PZPN expect me to go out to games and spend money on a semi professional league then no thanks. On top of that, I don’t want my head bashed in by a bunch of drunks for wearing my team colours. Oh and the guys that said that the MLS is a better league, although it may offend some of you, I totally agree. Money is one thing, and how long with the Polish league complain about a lack of money, but numbers speak for themselves. Honestly that shit is getting old. Its time to stop complaining and actually start producing some decent talent. Lets not hope for another Lato or Boniek to just come out of nowhere. These days their talents would probably go to waste under the current system.

This bring me to another unique Polish gem. Why did Gregory (Stalin) Lato bring all of his friends along with their families to RPA? We need fresh blood as the head of the PZPN. We can’t sit around and watch Lato and his communist style of leadership any longer. Their trip was all at the expense of the PZPN, meaning it was funded by the public. You guys wonder why Beenhakker has stopped fighting and has taken a back seat? He is too old to care about a program that refuses to change, for the better. He is just looking to collect all his paychecks until his contract is over. Considering his age, don’t think that he is looking to manage another team.

FIFA changes the age limit so now Sebastian Boenisch feels Polish again? Let me be the first to say: “NEIN” Geh zur Hölle. Fuck him and his stupid dad. Its too bad because he would have been starting for us now. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tBxZf_oGLSw

All teams have their ups and downs to name a few i begin with Spain, home of one of the best leagues in the world yet decades past before a major national victory. Then there is my favourite whipping boy England home of football but it always gave me great pleasure to see them miss out on a euro or world cup final. Add to the list the u.s.a and their mighty la galaxy along with beckham travelling down under to show us what a great league they come from only to be beaten 5/3 by an Australian A league team made up of 4th rate aussie players that can not make it to Europe including not good enough for the polish league. I’m sure the first two angered the supporters of England and Spain but look at them now it is amazing what 2 years or less can do.
The coaching staff and players will change in the near future but we are not the only team underperforming at this point in time e.g. portugal, sweden, czech, turkey,ukraine and france may have to play off for a place in it.
@ wejher and zaraza thanks for your comments you both made about Poland’s recent history if I had logged on sooner I would have said the same.

a, these players hadn’t really played together at all. they had a few days to try to perfect Leo’s strategy, which the A team clearly hasn’t. I’m saying, if these guys knew they were getting called up more in advance, and had more time to prepare, the scoreline would be different. I’m also saying that although the b team should have been motivated to play better I feel south africa and Iraq had more motivation. Getting prepared for a tournament is more motivating than fighting for a spot on the nt you’re probably not ready for. Look at the u-21 team. Not only have they been playing together repeatedly and training, but they are also playing for somthing more than a spot on the team. And as for complaining, its pretty much all most of us can do. By not going to League games you’re not acheiving anything. Don’t forget, the owners of the teams and the PZPN should have different agendas. Owners want to make money, and the PZPN should want to improve the national team. Unfortunately, it doesn’t always work that way. We’re outsiders in this. No one cares if you or I are unhappy with the team.

And finding a silver lining in all this gray is better than just bitching. The b team showed some good spells at the end of the Iraq game. If that’s not something to try to expand on, then what’s the point of rooting for Poland?

Wait wait wait wait “a”, you’re exagarating waaaaay too much. Take a freakin chill pill please.

First of all, the Polish ekstraklasa isnt nearly as bad as you’re trying to tell us. Polish teams have trashed quite a few of USA teams, so it is much better than the MLS for a start. Also, please name me some players from the MLS that made any impact in Europe? I can name only three, Brad Friedel, Tim Howard, and Beasley, and from these only Howard is a good player, Friedel is decent I guess. Yep, that’s about it, despite the fact that the MLS has millions of money, while the Polish league is one of the poorest in Europe. And with the little money they still managed to produce some decent players last years, even a Champions League winning one.

Second, the national team is pretty good. Not amazing, but definitley not terrible. There’s one bad thing though : Leo Beenhakker. Kick him out as soon as possible, I really started to dislike him recently. How can he think he’s better than Lato, while Lato has a freakin’ Golden shoe, and Leo doesn’t even have a cap for the Netherlands (lol). Calls up random players just because he feels like it. Flikker toch een eind op Leo.

Also the PZPN hasn’t done that bad really, Obraniak is going to play for Poland which is a huge accomplishment, if you can see the PZPN. Now just fire Leo please and I might get a little (very little) amount of faith in them again.

And about the friendlies: Losing to South Africa away is pretty bad yes, but not the worst result ever.
Drawing against the Asian Champions, away is a very decent result for Poland, especially since they played really well.

All in all, stop constantly spewing negativity. Yes, Poland isn’t amazing, deal with it. It’s been like that for years, it’s not like it’s a new thing As it stands, the current squad is much better than the squad way back at the WC 2006, which was much better then at the WC 2002. So there’s constant improvement, and that’s what counts. If it goes on like this, we might have a shot at the title at EURO 2012.

If you still can’t handle that, then indeed please stop supporting Poland.
Thank you very much.

Posted from  Netherlands

The Ekstraklasa really isnt that bad gotta stop complaing. Lech Poznan got farther than most countries all over europe did and in the early stages they destroyed teams. Wisla was able to beat Barcelona and destory the teams before barcelona like beating the Isreal Champions like 6 to 0. Legia is no push over they beat Shaktar or Dynamo Kyiv in a winter friendly as also Wisla beat one of them in the winter. MLS is trash i remember the last time Red Bulls played Bareclona i went to the match and they lost 6-0 or something around that to the Barcelona’s reserves. Cant forget about Slask Wroclaw which was bought out by the Polsat owner. He is building Poland’s largest shopping mall and all the profits go for the team. Its gonna be done a few years and they will be a club that will be able to challenge for at least the Europa League title. Cant forget that almost every team is having new stadiums built so that will bring in more revenue. As for the national team we have talented players like Jelen, Kuba, Orbaniak, Brozek, Smolarek,both Lewys, Fabian, and Boruc. I mean there are teams that would pray to have players like that in their NT.

Forgive me if I come off sounding a little negative. I like to think that I am a realist. Nevertheless, I am really passionate about Poland and our national team. My passion turns into anger when I remind myself of state of Polish football. I know the future looks bright but we’ve been hearing that for a long time. I guess the last straw for me was when Smolarek, arguably our best player, had a great opportunity to show what he could do in the Premiership and he failed. He could not establish himself and Megson had no confidence in him at all. Polish players have a bad reputation around Europe for being technically weak and generally lazy. How many times do we see our players go abroad and fail at embarrassingly shocking proportions. That is why Poland gets no respect when it comes to the domestic league or national team. Case in point Matusiak, Saganowski, Frankowski, or Rasiak. They were all great in the Ekstraklasa but did not find much success abroad. You could even throw Zurawski in that group as well.

I find that a lot of supporters of the national team will admit that there are serious problems. However, everyone always likes to say “oh well, what can you do.” That is the attitude that our senior squad has displayed for years. And comparing yourself to a weaker opponent does not justify your weaknesses. Making yourself feel better by comparing yourself to lesser opponents is no way to improve yourself. You have to look at the best and see where you are and how far you have to go until you reach your intended target.

Again, I live and breathe Polska. And discussing football with other Polish national team supporters keeps me sane. I vent because I care. I respect your opinions and enjoy your perspectives on the subject. Now I am off to beat my kid into a world class footballer.

I agree with you “a” , I have the same reactions, I like too much my NT and sometimes they really frustrated me. But one that I can’t forgive is Leo, we go nowhere with him, Gordon Strachan is available if Smuda isn’t

a, the people who argue that Smolarek is our best player are a small minority. The overwhelming majority would choose either Jelen and Blaszczykowski. Sure it’s disappointing that Smolarek didn’t make it in England, same for Matusiak, Frankowski, etc. but every country has players who flop abroad. Why do you only mention the negatives, what about Jelen, Blaszczykowski, Boruc, Piszczek who have become important players for their clubs?

Posted from  Canada

The PZPN needs to contact Laurent KOSCIELNY asap! He’s a solid central defender who is interesting a number of Ligue 1 clubs, including PSG, Auxerre, Marseille, Nice, and Monaco. France has never called him up, not even at junior level, so perhaps he’d be interested in playing for Poland.

Posted from  Canada

The Polish media says that Wawrzyniak is facing new doping charges, from a separate incident! Needless to say, he probably won’t be available for the September qualifiers.

They’re also suggesting that Sebastian Boenisch could be called up for Greece.. I don’t know, I thought he was a Volksdeutsch with no real connection to Poland other than being born there…

Posted from  Canada

that’s funny a – good luck with your kid. I’m working with my daughter (anyway the US here has the best women’s football teams). chester, sounds great … Slask Wroclaw ownership plans on track as was reported (don’t know what to believe in reports sometime).

I was negative about the effort vs. South Africa. If they would have looked like they cared to try, then the 1:0 loss to the home country that is all charged-up with all the football coming to their homeland vs our B team would not seem too bad. I didn’t get to see the game vs. the Iraq, but sounds like our boys had some good moments ^(adas and Tomek).

Tomek, I won’t defend Beenhakker this time, but you must know that skill on the field doesn’t necessarily translate to coaching and managing skills. A lot of coaches are born from lower league players; their wits often allowed them to over achieve as it is as players. I would judge Leo more harshly only if I saw truly spirited play from the Bialo Czerwoni.

The MLS seems to be getting a bit better. They do appear to play with a lot of spirit. Tons of hustle, but maybe not enough tactics and skill. Regarding US, you have to mention Dempsey: midfield for Fulham, started 28, played in 35, 7 goals, two assists. Beasley and Edu with the Rangers. Donovan played great in exhibition games for Bayern Munich on loan, but with the players they got he really didn’t have a chance for extended contract. More are playing in Europe B league teams – progress I guess.

zaraza and wejher: yeah, it is good that you bring up the history, because it is big reason of why and where Poland is in football development. It’s a hard pill to swallow being born in the US. I study the history a lot, I do carry the burden even though I was just born here*. I have the book: I Saw Poland Betrayed: An American Ambassadors Report to the American People: by Arthur Bliss Lane, and many other books including those by Polish authors. I feel that Arthur Lane would appreciated if I provide this, his quote: “I was able to accomplish nothing in effecting free elections in Poland. But I have accomplished one thing: I have shown to the whole world that nobody can believe the promises of the Soviet Government.” The source of the problem was Stalin and the Soviet Russians.

Friends, sorry for going off on the history: but even in England there were a few, like George Orwell who wrote: “I want to protest against the mean and cowardly attitude adopted by the British press towards the recent rising in Warsaw…..Do remember that dishonesty and cowardice always have to be paid for. Don’t imagine that for years on end you can make yourself the boot-licking propagandist of the Soviet régime, or any other régime, and then suddenly return to mental decency. Once a whore, always a whore.’ -from Norman Davis ‘Rising 44′.

*I grew up in a neighborhood with many Polish, Irish, German, and Italian american families. The neighborhood slowly became a majority of African americans. There was a “white flight” when black people moved into the neighborhood. (I don’t want to understand the reasons why; mostly it was worry about home values). Many African Americans were my friends. Some, because I was white, treated me like I was part of the problem of the slavery of their ancestors. I liked to think of my Polish heritage and dream of being Kościuszko: and when I am given slaves for my service, I would free them. And when I am given a General’s wage from by contributions to freedom, I would buy slaves to free them. And when I return to Poland, I will leave instructions that my land be sold to buy freedom and education for other slaves.

Posted from  United States

^…’for’ my contributions to freedom…

Posted from  United States

a, I’m not saying you can’t be a realist. But bitching to the likes of us doesn’t accomplish anything other than attack our already hurting egos. We can’t play on the team so we can be blamed for their actions. Therefore, we cheer for them. When they win, we win. When they lose, we lose. So, if there’s this much dissent among the fans, how must it be on the team? Because clearly, they aren’t functioning as a team. I can’t blame you for it. I can only ask that you find something to hold onto, becuase the next option for you is to give up on Polish soccer completely. I feel to many have done that already.

Nah, “a”, you’re not a realist. You’re a pessimist, at least I haven’t seen you say one good thing about Polish players, despite the fact that Kuba was chosen as one of the best wingers in the Bundesliga, and Jelen one of the best strikers of Ligue 1. Also the fact that 20 year old R.Lewandowski is currently ripping up the Polish league and constantly getting good offers from foreign clubs is not important at all.

Really, chill out man. Those 2 friendlies weren’t that terrible, i’ve seen much, much worse (for example the Northern Ireland game).

As about the MLS, well I’m sorry from being a bit negative but it still a fact that, while it’s a very rich league, it hasn’t produced many players that made an impact in Europe. Donovan failed in Europe, he only scores a lot in the MLS. I agree with Dempsey and Edu though, I forgot those.
Right now the Polish ekstraklasa does a better job.

About the PZPN, argue how much you want, they haven’t done anything really stupid since Lato. Obraniak will get a call up against Greece, which is great progress. They also are doing a decent job with EURO 2012. Really no big complaints currently. Also since the Polish league is getting more and more young talents I guess the PZPN has invested in the youth system after all.

Last about Leo. He just doesn’t belong here anymore. He doesn’t give a damn anymore: Hasn’t appeared during the last ekstaklasa games, while calling up completely random players for the last friendlies. Just seeing him bored makes me angry. Also his arrogance makes me sick, thinking he’s better than Lato. I’m very grateful that he helped us getting to Euro 2008, but now it’s over.

Who should replace him? Depends. People say a Polish coach but I can’t really suggest anyone. Smuda is decent I guess though he bottled it big time with Lech. Lato suggested a young coach, specifically Piotr Nowak. I have no idea how good he is, he works in the USA now. Anyone from the States know something more about him? If were going for a foreign coach again, then we have Avram Grant avalaible, the coach who got Chelsea to the Champion’s League final. No idea how he’ll do with Poland though.

Posted from  Netherlands

I feel that the negative far out weight the positives. Believe me, I am very grateful players like Kuba, Boruc, Fabianski, and Lewandowski to name a few. But you guys have to admit that the media and the fans like to assume that if one of our players attracts interest from a big club that he’s legit. There were many cases we have witnessed that did not turn out so good. The faster we build someone up for being the next star the faster we like to shit on them for not being able to deliver on our unattainable/unrealistic goals for them. I don’t know what it is. When someone does establish themselves as a regular for their team we, the fans, automatically assume and project on how good he will become. At the first sign of trouble we are excessively hard on them. Look at what happened to the squad, help me out on this I can’t remember exactly, in 2001 our under 18 team won first place. The only names I can remember from that squad are Kuszczak and Golanski. What happened there?

How can you stay positive when guys like Wawrzyniak fuck up their chance at something good. This will only hurt the reputation of Polish footballer further.

I understand the reasons why they could not have played well in South Afrika, legitimate or not. I’m angry at what has become a common approach to games. I don’t like that the players looked like they really did not belong on the pitch. You could say the names were picked out of a hat but that does say a lot of the quality of skill in the domestic league. It seems like they are being taught these bad habits from a young age. The tactics, strategy and general understanding of the game seems to be lacking considerably.

I am in no way able to help them. So all I have is to bitch. Talking about it shows that we care. Apathy is the worst thing that could happen for the national team. I am sure that interest in football and the national team is not looking so bright for the future generations. I know we can’t change the outcomes but we also can’t sit around and pretend that everything is alright. I for one will not accept mediocrity. I know our country is better than that and capable of greater things on the pitch than what they are currently offering.

Don’t get me wrong. I do believe that the Ekstraklasa is moving in the right direction. After the corruption bullshit, the fans are slowly starting to restore their faith in the game/product on the pitch. The new stadiums are looking great. Beenhakker was a positive step, a new voice. Things are looking up but after the golden years of Polish football it is long overdue.

As for Lato, we don’t know half of what goes on behind the scenes. Those types of things the public finds out only after the fact. Once Lato moves on the truth will resurface about the corruption, the terrible management of funds, and incompetence.

Wow 94 million euro for Ronaldo…

There’s a difference between discussing something and constantly bitching about everything.

There hasn’t been any corruption since Lato became president (This could be too early to tell of course). The last thing was the Reiss scandal, and that found place years ago. Please give Grzegorz a chance. He might have to looks of a “Lesny dziadek” but like I said he didn’t do anything wrong “yet”.

And Waw wasn’t good enough for Panathinaikos anyway, I doubt they would extend his loan, drug scandal or not.

And Ronaldo’s transfer is just the death of football. Wait, no. Football died a long time ago. The Ronaldo transfer just make’s football’s corpse spin more violently in it’s grave.

Posted from  Netherlands

How can a guy who can’t run his natiional team to a World Cup be worth so much? Skills are not, no one should be worth that kind of money.

i agree, the money is ridiculous

I’m confused, is this Sebastian Boenisch guy wanting to play for Poland now or not? I don’t speak German. But one of zaraza’s comments mentioned him possibly being called up in August against Greece for us…so I could use some clarification on that one. thanks

http://www.dziennik.pl/sport/pilkanozna/article397192/Sebastian_Boenisch_woli_grac_dla_Niemcow.html
The Polish newspaper Dziennik claims that Beenhakker wanted to call him up for Greece, however, Boenisch turned him down saying that it was “too late”. I think he sought attention from Poland in order to pressure Germany into calling him up, should have just ignored him. He made it clear that he’s a Volkdeutsh a while ago.

I’ve mentioned this a couple times before but I really hope Beenhakker talks to Laurent KOSCIELNY. He’s a highly-rated 23 year old center-back who played this past season in Ligue 2 however, a number of Ligue 1 clubs are interested in signing him. Auxerre fans say that he would be a regular starter for them. Given our defensive problems, Beenhakker really should be taking an interest in this player.

Posted from  Canada

Please tell me you’re joking about Strachan, If he were appointed manager of Poland i would cry, I was massively surprised when Celtic took him on, he’s not bad but he’s nowhere near good enough for what we need please nobody say “yeah but he’s won the Scottish championship x amount of times” yeah he did but he inherited one of the best 2 teams in the league and the other best team has’nt had a decent manager for e few years now for him to compete against, Walter smith comes back and wins the league with rangers in his first year back in charge – also look at what he did for Scotland against France and only just missing out on the qualifiers to Italy the reigning WC champions, He’s a quality manager. Leo is a bit of a mystery at times but you cant question his calibre and achievements. When we beat Portugal we were ready to make him King of Poland the same again after the Czech game, things go bad and suddenly everyone wants him hanged, we lost the games simply because we were shit on the pitch, he named the same squad as he had previously but the players were sloppy, Boruc’s head was somewhere in the clouds and our defenders thought the games would be a walk over and this is why we are not sat at the top of our group right now. We have our work cut out for us yes but I think we will still qualify. Northern Ireland and Slovakia the teams we lost to both have to play us on our turf yet, we get 6 points from that to add to our superior goal difference already then we’ll be home dry, just need to concentrate on the games in hand and not the media and use the last 2 frendlies as part of the development process, we learned Janczyk is quality but the rest of the new Boys were crap – silver lining.

Posted from  Greece